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Raspberry ketones great for fat burner and inhibits androgen receptors

This is a discussion on Raspberry ketones great for fat burner and inhibits androgen receptors within the Q & A with Patrick Arnold forums, part of the Supplements Discussion category; Patrick, It seems Raspberry inhibits androgen receptors. I have heard up to 20-25 % it lowers testosterone and maybe dht. ...

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    Raspberry ketones great for fat burner and inhibits androgen receptors


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    Patrick,

    It seems Raspberry inhibits androgen receptors. I have heard up to 20-25 % it lowers testosterone and maybe dht. If you look on some of the hair losss forums some guys are using this for hairloss. I think it is an effective fat burner and it puts doubts in my mind if I want to usse it because to me it looks like what we as bodybuilders, well at least myself, goal is --- well raspberry ketones seem like a no - no.

    can I get your thoughts on this study?

    Effect of essential oils, such as raspberry ketone... [Bioorg Med Chem Lett. 2010] - PubMed result



    Bioorg Med Chem Lett. 2010 Feb 21. [Epub ahead of print]
    Effect of essential oils, such as raspberry ketone and its derivatives, on antiandrogenic activity based on in vitro reporter gene assay.

    Ogawa Y, Akamatsu M, Hotta Y, Hosoda A, Tamura H.

    Department of Environmental Bioscience, Meijo University, Nagoya 468-8502, Japan.

    The effect of essential oils, such as raspberry ketone, on androgen (AR) receptor was investigated using a MDA-kb2 human breast cancer cell line for predicting potential AR activity. Among them, eugenol had the highest AR antagonistic activity with its IC(50) value of 19muM. Raspberry ketone, which has threefold higher anti-obese activity than that of capsaicin, also had AR antagonist activity with its IC(50) value of 252muM. Based on these findings, a more precise CoMFA model was proposed as follows: pIC(50) [log (1/IC(50))]=3.77+[CoMFA field terms] (n=39, s=0.249, r(2)=0.834, s(cv)=0.507, q(2)=0.311 (three components). Copyright © 2010. Published by Elsevier Ltd.

    PMID: 20226658 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

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    i have no idea if those concentrations translate into noticeable activity in-vivo from typical rasberry ketone doses

    anyway, you mention that it lowers testosterone and dht? why would that be? wouldnt you expect an anti-androgen to raise testosterone?
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    maaaaaaan! I WAS JUST gonna post the same question to pat LOL

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    may have worded it worngly- sorry

    androgen receptor antagonist is what I meant. Below is where the start of this came I believe and now people are talking about it on forums and such and opting not to use raspberry ketones believing it decreases test and dht

    Raspberry Ketone is an androgen receptor antagonist | Anthony Roberts Blog

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    I myself,have used a fat burner recently w/ras ketone & have not "felt" any loss in libido or anything of that nature.Although I was using L-carnitine the whole time also.

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    l-carnitine tartrate (and all carnitine versions in my opinion- but I can not prove it because the studies were only done on the tartrate ) upregulates androgen receptors

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    would it better if im injecting test/trt as i was thinking of doing it during ramadan while fasting.. made sense but...

    well

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    Quote Originally Posted by a_ahmed View Post
    would it better if im injecting test/trt as i was thinking of doing it during ramadan while fasting.. made sense but...

    well
    please stop posting nonsense -this thread is about raspberry ketones- make your own thread if your not going to contribute

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    so basically you are asking if rasberry ketones binding to the androgen receptor, but having no interaction with it effects something?

    that would be what an antagonist does, and I would think if it did this, it would cause an increase in free test as well as total test kind of in the same way the whole negative feedback loop thing works with an ai.

    body would think it has less test, and work on producing more.

    also, if it was competing with actual androgens for the androgen receptor, it would seem like the androgen would possibly win? idk just thinking with my fingers here.

    im thinking that androgens with alterations in their structure that change the half life may still allow the user to keep the androgenic effect, while still using rk's for w/e you are using them for?
    Last edited by bryan101b; 07-17-2011 at 10:56 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy234 View Post
    please stop posting nonsense -this thread is about raspberry ketones- make your own thread if your not going to contribute
    are you mentally challenged?

    I have 50g of rasberry ketones and im on trt, im wondering what negative or positive effects it'll have faggot.

    It may be negative on test in a non trt person but would it really affect someone that much i dont know.

    I was going to make the same thread but you did. don't be faggot.

    I want the myth or truth of it stopping/preventing muscle gains to be unravalled by pat... and or what positive negatives it may induce.

    I read somewhere that some study proved it to be '10x' more thermogenic than capacin... that all sounds great but im wondering if itll cause muscle dystrophy or something silly like that.
    Last edited by a_ahmed; 07-18-2011 at 04:50 PM.

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    looks like someone got their feelings hurt, guess the trt is working big time, getting all hormonal.
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    im always hormonal hahahaha dun worry i take it out on the weights I'm a nice guy, just don't step on my toes or I'll break your face

    Cant remember the last fight i was in, wife stopped each one LOL. Marriage does that to ya :P

    Now back to ketones n shiznit :P

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    The word faggot is a big no-no these days a-ahmed!! It is the new N word. You should have picked a better insult IMO- hahaha

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    oh i meant cigarette in the British slang.

    *sets up no-fag zone*

    It's still a really disgusting practice of throwing buds in holes. Society can make legal articles about it, profit from it, lobby with it, but it's still nasty practice of buds in holes.

    *So yea no-fag zone*


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    i just saw an argument about raspberry ketones?

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    Basically bottom line is... it has a a negative effect on androgen receptors i just read another review/article on it... but it does supposedly work as a fat burner like capacin does...

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    Almost a good thread! I'm interested in this. How ever no valuable in put except to say fags bring it on themselves, because their fags! Is like to hear a valid answer to his question.

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    You all are fags! Boom!

    I've been a fan of Raspberry Ketones since Matt turned me onto them.

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    these adhd threads ahhh =)

    anyways I already took the plunge and started using Raspberry ketones..if i notice any loss of muscle or anything Ill let ou know

    I don't think itll be that significant if anything; I could be wrong though. Just like saw palmetto and 5-ar may work some

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    I am using Raspberry ketones at 1 gram 2 times a day (2 grams total). I am interested in L-Carnitine Tartrate for upregulating androgen.
    Last edited by elevated; 01-14-2012 at 11:51 AM. Reason: grams total

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    i have no idea if those concentrations translate into noticeable activity in-vivo from typical rasberry ketone doses

    anyway, you mention that it lowers testosterone and dht? why would that be? wouldnt you expect an anti-androgen to raise testosterone?
    Quote Originally Posted by bryan101b View Post
    so basically you are asking if rasberry ketones binding to the androgen receptor, but having no interaction with it effects something?

    that would be what an antagonist does, and I would think if it did this, it would cause an increase in free test as well as total test kind of in the same way the whole negative feedback loop thing works with an ai.

    body would think it has less test, and work on producing more.

    also, if it was competing with actual androgens for the androgen receptor, it would seem like the androgen would possibly win? idk just thinking with my fingers here.

    im thinking that androgens with alterations in their structure that change the half life may still allow the user to keep the androgenic effect, while still using rk's for w/e you are using them for?
    Ummm, I am totally confused here. PA, I don't know if you were being sarcastic or not, but I'm assuming no. How in the world would an anti-androgen cause an INCREASE in testosterone or DHT if it competes for the receptor site? If the anti-androgen takes it's place on the receptor, testosterone nor DHT can bind and exert their effects. Does this really cause a negative feedback loop??? WTF. I understand this mechanism for an AI since it works on the enzyme that converts testosterone to estrogen, but anti-androgen????

    Please explain how androgen antagonists increase testosterone and DHT because I was under the impression that an antagonist exerts the OPPOSITE action of what the receptor exerts. If what you're saying is true, then wouldn't raspberry ketones increase testosterone and DHT?

    So confused.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    i have no idea if those concentrations translate into noticeable activity in-vivo from typical rasberry ketone doses

    anyway, you mention that it lowers testosterone and dht? why would that be? wouldnt you expect an anti-androgen to raise testosterone?
    Quote Originally Posted by bryan101b View Post
    so basically you are asking if rasberry ketones binding to the androgen receptor, but having no interaction with it effects something?

    that would be what an antagonist does, and I would think if it did this, it would cause an increase in free test as well as total test kind of in the same way the whole negative feedback loop thing works with an ai.

    body would think it has less test, and work on producing more.

    also, if it was competing with actual androgens for the androgen receptor, it would seem like the androgen would possibly win? idk just thinking with my fingers here.

    im thinking that androgens with alterations in their structure that change the half life may still allow the user to keep the androgenic effect, while still using rk's for w/e you are using them for?
    Ummm, I am totally confused here. PA, I don't know if you were being sarcastic or not, but I'm assuming no. How in the world would an anti-androgen cause an INCREASE in testosterone or DHT if it competes for the receptor site? If the anti-androgen takes it's place on the receptor, testosterone nor DHT can bind and exert their effects. Does this really cause a negative feedback loop??? WTF. I understand this mechanism for an AI since it works on the enzyme that converts testosterone to estrogen, but anti-androgen????

    Please explain how androgen antagonists increase testosterone and DHT because I was under the impression that an antagonist exerts the OPPOSITE action of what the receptor exerts. If what you're saying is true, then wouldn't raspberry ketones increase testosterone and DHT?

    So confused.

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    the answere you seek is the bolded in the post above.

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    Senior Member Knowledgeable User Patrick Arnold's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by D-575 View Post
    Ummm, I am totally confused here. PA, I don't know if you were being sarcastic or not, but I'm assuming no. How in the world would an anti-androgen cause an INCREASE in testosterone or DHT if it competes for the receptor site? If the anti-androgen takes it's place on the receptor, testosterone nor DHT can bind and exert their effects. Does this really cause a negative feedback loop??? WTF. I understand this mechanism for an AI since it works on the enzyme that converts testosterone to estrogen, but anti-androgen????

    Please explain how androgen antagonists increase testosterone and DHT because I was under the impression that an antagonist exerts the OPPOSITE action of what the receptor exerts. If what you're saying is true, then wouldn't raspberry ketones increase testosterone and DHT?

    So confused.
    your hypothalamus has androgen receptors. it also has estrogen and progesterone receptors, and all of these will bind to circulating sex hormones. When they bind and activate they initiate the negative feedback signal. If you block them and prevent their activation then you will block the negative feedback and your sex hormone production will go up

    i think you just forgot the fact that your HPTA works via receptors
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