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Ketocana Amazing New Exogenous Ketone Product From Pa


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#26 truthornothin

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:04 AM

?


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#27 truthornothin

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:05 AM

Na++++++++++++++++++

??


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#28 Biggame

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:19 AM

Initial batch looks sold out. I should be receiving mine this week. Going to just mix it with water intra-workout fasted and see how it goes I'll probably just use on workout days.

#29 truthornothin

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 10:32 AM

Initial batch looks sold out. I should be receiving mine this week. Going to just mix it with water intra-workout fasted and see how it goes I'll probably just use on workout days.

Yes the initial batch is gone and we are working feverishly to get another in the can. Will keep you updated. I would recommend pre workout rather than intra or split the dose and do half pre and half intra. 


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#30 Oper8

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Posted 08 December 2014 - 11:14 PM

??

Sodium, lots of it


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#31 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 10:37 AM

Sodium, lots of it

 

 

1.3 grams per serving.   54 percent of RDA.   Its not outrageous


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#32 truthornothin

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 11:05 AM

Sodium, lots of it

Just a few things to put the sodium content into perspective" A McDonalds big breakfast with hot cakes and egg whites has 2.17 grams of sodium. A chicken and bacon Mc Wrap has 1.29 grams 

 

Also we are athletes( well some of us) we sweat and excrete sodium in doing so see this link

 

http://www.healthcas...on_sodium.shtml


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#33 Needanewname

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 03:02 PM

I went through several bottles of ketoforce, switched to this (two tubs).  So far, I think I prefer ketoforce, are you planning to discontinue it?

 

Also, I'm thinking keto(force/CaNa), cop, (citrulline malate/TAA pick one), bcaa/peptopro on a ketogenic diet is probably an awesome PWO.



#34 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 03:56 PM

I went through several bottles of ketoforce, switched to this (two tubs).  So far, I think I prefer ketoforce, are you planning to discontinue it?

 

Also, I'm thinking keto(force/CaNa), cop, (citrulline malate/TAA pick one), bcaa/peptopro on a ketogenic diet is probably an awesome PWO.

 

No we will continue the ketoforce


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#35 truthornothin

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 05:22 PM

I went through several bottles of ketoforce, switched to this (two tubs).  So far, I think I prefer ketoforce, are you planning to discontinue it?

 

Also, I'm thinking keto(force/CaNa), cop, (citrulline malate/TAA pick one), bcaa/peptopro on a ketogenic diet is probably an awesome PWO.

Why do you like Ketoforce better? Just curious, I jumped for joy when this became available, I've been using it a few months now and like it head and shoulders above KF. its palatable and no lower GI issues for me


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#36 Biggame

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 06:41 PM

Yes the initial batch is gone and we are working feverishly to get another in the can. Will keep you updated. I would recommend pre workout rather than intra or split the dose and do half pre and half intra.


45 mins preworkout ok?
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#37 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 06:56 PM

Na++++++++++++++++++

Na+     Ca++


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#38 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 06:58 PM

45 mins preworkout ok?

 

15 minutes better


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#39 Oper8

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 07:26 PM

Just a few things to put the sodium content into perspective" A McDonalds big breakfast with hot cakes and egg whites has 2.17 grams of sodium. A chicken and bacon Mc Wrap has 1.29 grams 

 

Also we are athletes( well some of us) we sweat and excrete sodium in doing so see this link

 

http://www.healthcas...on_sodium.shtml

 "Us athletes" aren't eating McDonalds (at least partly d/t the sodium content). I'm also in no way bashing the product, beautifully innovative as usual, but if you're gonna post a link about potential increased sodium loss in athletes, it might also be prudent to post one or two of the thousands of articles on the associated health risks of excessive sodium consumption (just to be fair). No problem with being educated on both sides of the coin.


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#40 Biggame

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 09:23 PM

15 minutes better


Ok thanks. Won't try until tomorrow but opened the tub and the powder smells good.

#41 keyser

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 10:32 PM

 "Us athletes" aren't eating McDonalds (at least partly d/t the sodium content). I'm also in no way bashing the product, beautifully innovative as usual, but if you're gonna post a link about potential increased sodium loss in athletes, it might also be prudent to post one or two of the thousands of articles on the associated health risks of excessive sodium consumption (just to be fair). No problem with being educated on both sides of the coin.

I thought for people that don't have high blood pressure that high sodium doesn't do much, and even for those with hypertension it's more the ratio of K/Na ? Is that wrong?
And since this is a product used mostly by people on low carb diets.. Isn't it more often a problem that the sodium intace is too low?
Also, don't you believe the diet has no role in cardiac disease?  



#42 Needanewname

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Posted 09 December 2014 - 10:45 PM

Why do you like Ketoforce better? Just curious, I jumped for joy when this became available, I've been using it a few months now and like it head and shoulders above KF. its palatable and no lower GI issues for me

Powder is more volatile (makes clouds if the air is moving) and requires mixing instead of 'just pour it into the coffee cup'.  I'm very happy with both products, but all things being equal, my next purchase will probably be back to KetoForce. 

 

What's the pH of a glass of KetoCaNa?  I remember PA said the pH of KF was like 12, which caused a little anxiety.  I know alkaline pH stuff eats the shit out of teeth (by dissolving the non-enamel organics), is that an issue?  How much acid/water is needed to dilute it to something nicer than 12?



#43 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 06:17 AM

 "Us athletes" aren't eating McDonalds (at least partly d/t the sodium content). I'm also in no way bashing the product, beautifully innovative as usual, but if you're gonna post a link about potential increased sodium loss in athletes, it might also be prudent to post one or two of the thousands of articles on the associated health risks of excessive sodium consumption (just to be fair). No problem with being educated on both sides of the coin.

there are sodium senstiive hypertensives out there and they need to be careful with sodium intake.  many hypertensives arent sodium sensitive however


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#44 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 06:20 AM

Powder is more volatile (makes clouds if the air is moving) and requires mixing instead of 'just pour it into the coffee cup'.  I'm very happy with both products, but all things being equal, my next purchase will probably be back to KetoForce. 

 

What's the pH of a glass of KetoCaNa?  I remember PA said the pH of KF was like 12, which caused a little anxiety.  I know alkaline pH stuff eats the shit out of teeth (by dissolving the non-enamel organics), is that an issue?  How much acid/water is needed to dilute it to something nicer than 12?

 

 

 

pH of a glass of KetoCaNa should be around 4.5

 

pH of ketoforce is adjusted to 10-11.   Shouldnt be alkaline enough to damage your gums.   But still if you mix with an acidic bevarage 6 ouncs or so you will lower it to the neutral range


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#45 Oper8

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 09:19 AM

I thought for people that don't have high blood pressure that high sodium doesn't do much, and even for those with hypertension it's more the ratio of K/Na ? Is that wrong?
And since this is a product used mostly by people on low carb diets.. Isn't it more often a problem that the sodium intace is too low?
Also, don't you believe the diet has no role in cardiac disease?  

 

 

there are sodium senstiive hypertensives out there and they need to be careful with sodium intake.  many hypertensives arent sodium sensitive however

You don't have to be an elite athlete to eat a low carb diet or to use a nutritional supplement. For the sake of argument, A product like this could be catastrophic for someone with CHF. Am I legitimately concerned or think anyone like that would use this product? Absolutely not. But the correct response from a product rep would have been: "yes the sodium content is high, keep in mind most people using the product are athletes with excess sodium losses, however, the product may not be appropriate for individuals with a history of heart disease, HTN, CHF, stroke, or anyone on a low sodium diet". Rather than just saying us athletes have high sodium losses or comparing it to a McDonalds breakfast. BTW, I don't believe diet causes heart disease, but it plays a role in diseases such as HTN, diabetes, and obesity, which are known causes of heart disease.


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#46 BrianP0523

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 03:38 PM

i will be sure to wash down my egg mcmuffins with ketocana



#47 Patrick Arnold

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 03:57 PM

 "yes the sodium content is high, keep in mind most people using the product are athletes with excess sodium losses, however, the product may not be appropriate for individuals with a history of heart disease, HTN, CHF, stroke, or anyone on a low sodium diet".

 

You mean like the warnings they put on potato chips, french fries, pretzels, etc etc


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#48 Oper8

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 04:26 PM

You mean like the warnings they put on potato chips, french fries, pretzels, etc etc


Again comparing the product to McDonalds. He robbed a bank so I robbed a bank. Maybe us athletes should strive to be a little more conscientious than Mickey D's? Isn't this why the FDA is increasingly becoming more involved in the supplement industry? Also, that quoted comment of mine had nothing to do with warnings/labels, I was stating what my response would have been.(though I do think warnings like that should be on labels)
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#49 truthornothin

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 05:18 PM

Again comparing the product to McDonalds. He robbed a bank so I robbed a bank. Maybe us athletes should strive to be a little more conscientious than Mickey D's. Isn't this why the FDA is increasingly becoming more involved in the supplement industry? Also, that quoted comment of mine had nothing to do with warnings or labels, I was stating what my response would have been.

We had already stated the sodium amounts. My Father has to watch his sodium. People that know they do read the labels. Our label lists sodium amounts. It is not excessively hign for a normal person. I was not suggesting that people eat McDonalds, though I know a crap load of bb'ers that eat there. I was simply giving a food comparison for reference. That is all.  

 

Here are some newer studies calling into question sodium restrictions regarding heart failure. 

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....cles/PMC2955483

 

/http://circ.ahajourn.../126/4/479.full

 

the sodium is listed  on the label, its no more than your average ff meal, and from the research I've seen, its not apt to be "Catastrophic"  since the heart failure recommendation for daily sodium intake is 2grams and even that has level may be over cautious as stated in the articles listed 

 

Check out the sources in the 1st article. There is no need to sound alarms about sodium, there is not an astounding amount in this product  and it is on the label.  I do not believe anything I said makes me a poor rep.  Nor am I under informing anyone.

 

Check out the bullet proof guys, they are recommending taking 1/2 to 1 teaspoon of salt upon

waking.   Not sure what I should have been warning people about. The amount of sodium was already discussed in the thread.


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#50 truthornothin

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Posted 10 December 2014 - 05:25 PM

We had already stated the sodium amounts. My Father has to watch his sodium. People that know they do read the labels. Our label lists sodium amounts. It is not excessively hign for a normal person. I was not suggesting that people eat McDonalds, though I know a crap load of bb'ers that eat there. I was simply giving a food comparison for reference. That is all.  

 

Here are some newer studies calling into question sodium restrictions regarding heart failure. 

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm....cles/PMC2955483

 

/http://circ.ahajourn.../126/4/479.full

 

the sodium is listed  on the label, its no more than your average ff meal, and from the research I've seen, its not apt to be "Catastrophic"  since the heart failure recommendation is 2grams and even that has level may be over cautious as stated in the articles listed 

 

Check out the sources in the 1st article. There is no need to sound alarms about sodium, there is not an astounding amount in this product  and it is on the label.  I do not believe anything I said makes me a poor rep.  Nor am I under informing anyone.

 

Check out the bullet proof guys, they are recommending taking 1/2 to 1 teaspoon of salt upon

waking.   Not sure what I should have been warning people about. The amount of sodium was already discussed in the thread.

One last point, This is not a "General public" type of thread. Not too many non athletic types are going to be on Pro Hormone's  forum ?  No? 


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